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    Old 12-06-2005, 12:45 PM   #1
    hyperkim
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    Graves or Hashi's

    I am confused. If you test positive for thyroid antibodies, do you have Graves or Hashi's? I have read where someone tested positive and were told they had Graves. And somewhere else someone tested positive and were told they has Hashi's.

    Can having antibodies make you swing both ways?

    Are they refering to different antibody tests?

    Any help would be appreciated

    Thanks, hyperkim

     
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    Old 12-06-2005, 02:54 PM   #2
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    Re: Graves or Hashi's

    Hello. I am one of those somebodys. I tested positive for Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies and Thyroglobulin Antibodies, which is consistent with Hashi's. I ALSO tested positive for Thyroid Stimulating Immunoglobulins (TSI) which is consistent with Graves'.

    As for an "official diagnosis" I am still hanging in there. One doctor says Graves', the other says a bad case of Hashi's. I am more likely inclined to believe I really have a little of both cause I get hyper so often. I am such a weird case though so its hard to judge. My body temp is almost always 99.2 or higher and my heart is always whaling at 99 BPM or higher yet my TSH was just 16 and my Free T4 was right at the very bottom of the range!

    "Classic Graves'" will have a TSH of zero or very close to zero and Free T4 will usually be elevated beyond the normal range. For me, I am certainly not "classic" graves' so its throwing the doctors off. Nobody really knows what the hell is wrong with me quite honestly cause my numbers just don't make any sense.

     
    Old 12-06-2005, 03:16 PM   #3
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    Re: Graves or Hashi's

    Nastyhashi, Thanks for the reply. That helps a bit.

    let me clarify one thing. tell me if I'm right. There are different antibody tests to determine Graves or Hashi's.?.

    My labs were as you say "classic" graves- non existant TSH with T4 and T3 above normal ranges. but my dr ordered a TPO test. I thought that was Hashi's specific. Am I wrong?

    I am new to the whole thyroid issue/mess/thingy. And supposedly no one in my family has a thyroid problem. (Only my paternal grandmother has a goiter. And I am told she is the only one. And that it doesn't run in our family. ????) Could I be in a large group of undiagnosed thryoid disorders and not know it?

    Sorry, I got sidetracked. Antibodies. Any knowledge you can pass on would be appreciated.

    Thanks, Kim

     
    Old 12-06-2005, 05:09 PM   #4
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    Re: Graves or Hashi's

    TSI is the "Graves' marker".
    I think the number is about 60% of people with classic graves also has TPO Abs.

    There is a lot of crossover from what I've gathered. People with Graves can have hashi's and people with hashi's can have Graves....its a very thin line for us on the border.

    For you, TPO antibodies only says you could have graves or you could have hashis - it gets you no further along.

    TSI would probably be a better indicator cause TSI is more specific to Graves alone. Most patients with Hashi's do not have high TSI antibodies.

    Next, a biopsy can let you know if it is Graves or not by the cells that are extracted MOST, not all of the time.

    The protocol is basically like this:

    IF you have high TPO and/or TSI antibodies
    AND you have zero TSH
    AND you have High Free T4
    ...you have Graves'.

    If any of the above are not true, then you fall into the "I'll never get diagnosed zone" where I currently reside. Anything less than above and its usually Hashi's according to most doctors.

    There is another recognized offshoot called "hashitoxicosis" that acknowledges the presence of graves and hashi's you might want to look into.

    From my own experience and what you described so far, you've got Graves'.

     
    Old 12-07-2005, 05:27 AM   #5
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    Re: Graves or Hashi's

    Thanks Nastihashi. I appreciate your opinion. The cross over on the TPO explains why I have gotten confused. When I go back in I'll ask my dr to test for TSI ab.

    Thank you again for your replies. If you think of anything else....let me know.

    Have a wonderful holiday season!
    Kim

     
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