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    Old 05-20-2008, 06:52 AM   #1
    mkgb
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    Cool Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    First things first:
    My relevant Threads Summary:
    Week 5
    [url]http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=601986[/url]
    Humm.. this was a rambler. We went over a few things old and new. Peruse at your leisure, if you so desire. More on physical and pulmonolgy effects.. as well as medicine and adrenal questions and my opinions.

    Week 3 and 4 of my Thyroid care and concerns thread series:
    [url]http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=599141[/url]
    This thread has a lot of discussion on the mental(cognitive), genetic probabilities, and physical effects (cardiological and pulmonary to name a few) of thyroid disorders. Look into it if you are interested.

    Week 2 of my Thyroid care and concerns thread series:
    [url]http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=597479[/url]
    This thread is jam packed with information on my ideas and opinion of what optimal and basic thyroid care should be.. accuracy of testing.. necessity of testing.. TSH suppression.. TPOAb and TSI effects and mechanisms.. Latest TSH range.. change in 2006 to 0.3-2.5! It is a lot of good stuff. It is a must read for all you getting started and questioning, “Am I getting the care I deserve?” For most the answer is “NO, I am not!”

    Week 1 of my thyroid care and concerns series..
    [url]http://www.healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=595898[/url]
    you can read a bit about me and my story.. it continues on in the following weeks.. as well as others. It also goes into why I feel and will keep up with these weekly threads as long as I am permitted.

    SO WE ARE OFF A DAY LATE.. but it is better than a week! Next post I am compiling to start the week off on will be on sleep and thyroid issues. Look for it! More of my opinions and research.

    MG
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    Old 05-20-2008, 07:51 AM   #2
    mkgb
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    This is my personal experience and take on sleep disorders. Sleep disorders are so overlooked in not only adults, but children as well that many suffer needlessly out of ignorance.

    My recent personal fight after discovering my sleep apnea a few years ago has been for my husband and son. Both who have sleep apnea as well. In children ADD, ADHD, and hyperactivity is a common misdiagnoses for one of the prevalent symptoms in children under the age of 8 suffering from sleep apnea and/or extreme sleep deprivation. Sloth like behavior, laziness, depression, and anxiety are the prevalent symptoms in sleep disorder sufferers above the age of 8. Now 8 is not the magic age.. on ones 8th birthday they will not necessarily turn into a pumpkin and have sleep apnea of the adult version. But brain physiology and physical changes occur around the age of 8 that you will begin to see a transition in symptoms similar to ADHD to ADD etc. We are talking statistical averages again.. BUT as we know we are all unique and thus will add our own flare to any issue.

    My son is five years old now and has severe sleep apnea and hypopnea. I was told by four different pediatricians that sleep disorders do not effect children. They were WRONG!!! Most non-specialized physicians have only had a fifteen minute seminar on sleep disorders and as a result DO NOT KNOW WHAT TO LOOK FOR! Pediatricians are some of the least educated in this regard, because sleep disorders are not supposed to effect children if the MYTH's are true. These same MDs just treat the symptoms drawn to their attention and do NOT track down the source. FACT not MYTH: Sleep disorders can be diagnosed as early as six months.

    Sleep apnea is especially important to diagnose and treat in children. In an adult it is going to give you mood issues, immune issues, weight gain, godzilla morning wake ups and more.. but in children it will compromise learning ability and growth potential. It will literally stunt there growth and development, trapping them with in themselves. In my son's case, it was a year after being diagnosed for sleep apnea myself and treating every possible physical cause in my son first.. adenoidectomy and ear tubes to treat fluid retained hearing loss and chronic ear infections, as well as a tonsillectomy to regulate snoring and chronic sinus issues that our family ENT finally suggested that he concurred with my latest theory on sleep apnea and I should look into a sleep study for my son. In most children and adenoidectomy and tonsillectomy correct a transient obstructive sleep apnea in children from 1-4, but if you have both out and snoring/mouth breathing persists.. sleep apnea is almost a guaranteed.

    So what symptoms and traits identify sleep apnea... this applies to thyroid induced or inherent structural issues:
    IF you or your child has more than one of these symptoms or all consult a sleep specialist.

    1) If your child is younger than 8 and snores, the child most likely has obstructive sleep apnea(OSA). Children under the age of 8 should not snore. If you snore loudly or mouth breath in your sleep you are at a higher risk as an adult of having sleep apnea.

    2) If you or your child gasps for breath, does extensive nocturnal throat clearings, or appear to hold your breath in sleep. (OSA again)

    3) If you or your child grinds their teeth, sleep walks or talks, wakes more than once a night after the age of two.. OSA once again. Sleep walking after the age of 8 is a dead give away to having a sleep disorder!

    4) If you are not as big as any of your siblings or your child has a depression of their growth rate.. such as going from 99% to 50% in a period of 6 months to a year.. sleep or thyroid issues should be investigated. Failure to thrive is a common sign in children thyroid and sleep disorders.

    5) Chronic ear and respiratory infections... sign of enlarged adenoids and tonsils obstructing drainage and air flow. Points to an increased chance of OSA.

    6) In children around and under the age of 8 - poor behavior and attention span.. hyper activity.. insomnia.. bedwetting.. inability to sit still(for fear of going to sleep).. these are signs of extreme sleep deprivation and OSA once again.

    7) There are more.. fatigue, falling asleep in the car, and a lot more that can point and go hand in hand with thyroid issues.. I will go into that more in the next post.

    I am not saying ADD, ADHD, and other disorders are not valid diagnoses; but, if even one child has sleep apnea and was over looked due to ignorance, I hope this and you all might help me catch them.

    My son's poor behavior change over night. His lack of growth has stopped and in his year on his CPAP: he has grown and resumed is 99.5% growth curve standing in weight and height. He sleeps through the night, no more bed wetting, and can control his mood swings and temper. I know when he has grown and his CPAP needs change because his mood and sleep cycle become interrupted. It is a bit scary, but as long as I am observant and keep in close contact with his teachers we can catch any shift in sleep demand in a matter of a couple of days. My sleep MD thinks that my son has had sleep apnea all his life and luckily, it has been caught early enough any lost growth and development can be recovered. So the earlier you catch sleep apnea the better.

    Sleep apnea is also genetically linked and so are thyroid issues... so if your child or you do have it... it came from someone directly in line with you. My husband and I both have sleep apnea. I have the OSA (obstructive sleep apnea) and my husband has the hypopnea version... my son has both of ours , poor kid. I didn't know I had it until I was 30! At least my son knows and has his CPAP and will not suffer the sleep issues I had in my later years. My sleep MD thinks I may have had it since birth.. hence me being 6 inches shorter than everyone else, but my Hashi's grandma. My husband has been battling depression, anxiety, the inability to stay awake and wake up for years and years. With his CPAP all those symptoms are gone. He just wasn't breathing deep enough in his sleep and couldn't keep his blood O2 levels high enough as a result. I have obstructive sleep apnea, but it manifested in chronic fatigue, sleep cleaning, and insomnia.. with my CPAP I can sleep and was able lose weight.. until my thyroid took another dive into dysfunction. With my increasing thyroid issues, my CPAP demands have changed as well. As I go more hypoT I need a higher CPAP pressure and more rigid MD overview. BUT it is manageable now I know what to look for... It is estimated that 2 out of 100 children have sleep apnea and less than 1 out of 5000 have been caught and treated appropriately. Just think on that.. all those children suffering and parents suffering because their kids can not sleep properly! Gives me the chills.*Burrr* Oh that was just the AC kicking on and blowing on me.

    Now I have got the story out of the way.. I will go into more detail of sleep and thyroid issues. Still compiling the references... so you need to wait a bit more. Sorry.

    MG
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    Old 05-20-2008, 09:31 PM   #3
    osteoblast
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    MKG-no sleep questions here, but--I would sleep better if I could know that my appt. with the ENT will go as desired on Fri. MY concern is that even with TPO over 1100(previously 2300), 7 nodules 2-8mm, hashi's reactive lymph node. Repeated pattern of tenderness and swelling in my neck. Even my dentist thinks neck is swollen. And, first yr. treatment tsh steady at 1.0-1.5 and second yr. of treatment no target readings-all like up to 6 or down to 0.48 and no steadiness whatsoever.Levels checked almost ea. 2 months. I have alot of readings over the past 12 mo. And, psychological/physical toll of vacillating levels is now just too much. So, I wonder is it possible that ENT just says you do not meet standard protocols for TT. My pcp a senior doc-is in favor of TT. My endo says it is my call. Well, what objections do you think I should expect from the ENT and how can I deal with those objections? Oh, when I went for the FNA-the doc said I wouldn't know where to begin, there are so many nodules and nothing stands out. I believe I read that the more nodules there are the more difficult it is to get an accurate read via fna on whether there is cancer in a nodule. It would seem like psychological torture to just sit and wait this out, now the endo is doing the u/s in 3 mo. from the last-not sure if 3 mo. would be the new standard time between u/s's but I really do not have the constitution for this kind of periodic stressing.And, 7 nodules is a pretty ravaged thyroid , I would think.
    I really feel that my whole neck area is swollen--I used to wonder if this was something to do with getting older-now 55. But, with the dentist saying that about swollen neck, I just wonder if I have alot of lymph gland involvement that just ebbs and flows with TPO attacks. So, any thoughts on what are the ENT's possible objections and how to get my case across as clearly as possible. I have already promised myself I am not going to cry if she puts me off.I will be disappointed though.If this doesn't work I will need to have my pcp find another surgeon. The problem is that I think the ENT that I will see would be the best surgeon.

    Last edited by osteoblast; 05-20-2008 at 09:53 PM.

     
    Old 05-20-2008, 10:04 PM   #4
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    Osteoblast,

    I am waiting a year for another ultrasound and that is with 6 nodules and a reactive lymph node. I know my neck is swollen and sometimes aches, but I do not have antibodies. The nodule and node they FNAed were benign. They chose the sites that had the most blood vessels in my case and looked the most suspicious. Having more nodules does not lower your risk for cancer it is equal.

    If I really wanted to have a TT there was an ENT eager to do it, but I wasn't sure he was as experienced as I would have liked.

     
    Old 05-21-2008, 09:19 AM   #5
    osteoblast
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    MG-I went over some of your earlier postings and found a reference to the thyroid disease mananger . In my developing thoughts about TT -I just found something impt. there. At chapter 18 just below figure 18-17 it talks about thyroxine therapy after cancer has been found and thyroidectomy. It mentions suppression therapy heard . It says that suppression therapy should NOT be done in post-menopausal women because of risk of osteoporosis. I have very serious osteoporosis that is being managed by a prof at the med univ. in our state. And, I have to do daily injections of a drug which carries alot of risk . . This makes me think even more that if they just allow me to go on a wait and see to a potential cancer situation(yes, I know it may or may not happen) but if it did and I had to be on suppressive therapy this would be really bad for me. Before I go with the argument , I wanted to ask you if you would to look over that paragraph right under Fig. 18-17 it is a short para. and let me know if you read this info as I do. I am sorry to put this on your sleep thread, I didn't know if your sleep thread would also be MG's grab bag this week. If you don't want this stuff here, could you respond in a separate thread? I need to be sure my concerns are valid when I present them to the ENT on Fri. Please let me know your thoughts. Thanks

    Last edited by osteoblast; 05-21-2008 at 09:21 AM.

     
    Old 05-21-2008, 10:21 AM   #6
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    You should know by now Osteo.. that as long as it is thyroid or endocrine in nature.. all is fair game on this thread. Hence thyroid care and concerns. I just started off with the sleep stuff because it was a request last week. I will look over the site of interest later and get back to you on it as well.

    Today was my visit to the Neurologist to discuss my MRI and the lumbar puncture results with oligomeric banding and destroyed Milean(sp) protien. Well it was an interesting and surprising appointment.

    I arrive armed with 100 pages of lab work going back over 3 years. They just love me. He hadn't received the lab work indicating the adrenal issues or the increase in antibody levels etc...
    so I came to the rescue there.. I was getting revved up to defend my stand on Hashimoto's ENcephalopathy when he starts asking ME questions. He is testing my visual range, peripheral vision, flinch response, blink response, balance, walking, gait.. it goes on. Then he says Good you have a 35% improvement since last visit. He discussed the only change since then.. thyroid medication and a decrease in my antibody levels by 1/2. Now I take my breath and get ready to launch into lecture mode when we get a knock at the door. Another MD shows up to talk about a patient with Hashimoto's Encephalopathy. I am like ME, ME, yes! Well this is an Endocrinologist and I am listening avidly. Only to hear him admit he knows nothing about treating Hashimoto's thyroiditis.. much less HE! My balloon deflated and the Endo was directed to Mr. X that had been hospitalized with Hashimoto's Encephalopathy and is now on the rigid steriodal treatment and able to walk and talk again. Now I am BOILING and ready to pop.

    Dr. C says AH back to you! You have mildly increased spinal fluid pressure. You are not Psuedo tumor cerebri.. you are not MS.. because your banding and serum protien and physical acuity and MRI refute such... we need to test for Lupus. I asked him.. knowing he needed a positive ANA to go down that track.. what blood work he needed. He said, " We shall start with X, then Y, then Z." He pulls out the magic pad and I say wait a minute... and pull out X, Y, and Z.. all negative. He then tells me I do not have Lupus. *SNORT* Well I asked what could cause the banding if it is not Lupus or MS. He says I am left with one source. Hashimoto's thyroiditis induced neuropathy.. aka HE! I almost did a little dance. NOW I am batting 100 to my Endos 0! He then proceeds to burst my bubble. I am improving on the steriodal adrenal treatment and the thyroid medication. Neuropathy and migraines and vision loss has decreased and my memory has improved. But I told him I am not optimal. He say you are not optimal in T4 either.. you need optimal T4 or your brain function suffers. WHAM! Slam dunk. His practice is to treat the thyroid and in my case the adrenals. Yhe neuropathy may be knocked back into remission this way. In the mean time I have a standby script of high dose prednisone for HE flare ups. He isn't sure if a TT would help matters, but it wouldn't hurt matters. He wants to leave that in the hands of my ENdo and ENT. I told him I do not have an Endo anymore. He asked about Dr. S. I told him I have no faith in her to treat me adequately. She was certian my heart and brain and body issues were anything but the thyroid. He pointed out that I have proof otherwise now. I told him my cardiologist gave him proof and she blew him off.. so no go. He told me NOT to use Dr. M.. the endo that visited .. and that he had no ENdo he knew or could recommend. I told him I was looking into a couple out of state and would give him the name of a goodun if I found one.

    SO to make a long story short. I have neuropathy and classic migraines induced by Hashimoto's and aggravated by my continued T4 hypoT state. This is one flavor of Hashimoto's encephalopathy.. most likely EARLY onset. Being on steriods during my biggest myexadema (sp) flares has helped avert a lot of damage so far. My Endo wants to see how I improve when optimized on meds and my antibodies are even lower. He is going to do more research into a TT as a possible stop and cure to HE and I have another appointment with him in 4 months. He hopes given the size of the lump on my throat that in 4 months the TT will be over.

    SO I have an informal.. I would do a TT, but medically I am covering my rear and not going to sanction a TT on paper.

    Well that was my day so far.

    Now I am going to chill. Maybe I will lie on the floor and join my cat in watching my fish swin about.. it gives it a wierd upside down profile.

    MG
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    Last edited by mkgb; 05-21-2008 at 10:21 AM.

     
    Old 05-21-2008, 12:38 PM   #7
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    Well, you had a big morning! You did a bang up job with your prep. Congratulations. It all sounds quite complicated. But, you are getting better and it seems you can head off the HE ! All very good news. But prednisone.... From Strong Women Strong Bones, p. 60 Miriam Nelson Ph.d. at Tufts says that the steroids have a combination of effects that lead to bone loss, decreased absorption of calcium, increased urinary excretion of calcium and also inhibited bone formation of osteoblasts. I wonder if you can use the steriods sparingly or whether there is a more bone friendly choice of treatment. It seems this doctor is not going to stand in the way of a TT- but not order it. Now, you need to find your endo-good luck. What was your issue with the endo dept at vanderbilt? I would think that possibly you could find a really good endo there, just check their back story as you said before. To me you sound like a good candidate for a med school affiliated clinic because your situation is definitely not common garden variety hypo.Maybe your neuro knows someone in the endo dept. at vanderbilt. Good Luck!

     
    Old 05-21-2008, 02:43 PM   #8
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    Interesting... my son was diagnosed with ADHD in December, mostly because he was being crazy in class. I am a Special Ed teacher and I observed him and it seemed like it to me! Plus we were experiencing many of these same problems at home. Like not sitting still when eating, even watching TV.

    But it's weird when you mention the sleep thing because ever since he was a baby, he would never sleep through the night! I think the first time he ever slept through MOST of the night was when he was 3. Last october he had his adenoids removed as he was snoring and had mucus in his nose for over 6 months that would just not go away! So I don't hear him snore anymore, but he tells me sometimes that he wakes up outside his door and doesn't know how he got there. Last month he was waking up every night at 10:35 screaming and running back and forth in his room screaming about something not getting him or no, get away from me?? It seems to have stopped since my mom got here, but he wakes up quite often to go to the bathroom, and I know he's not getting enough sleep.

    But what do you tell the doctor? Especially here in the military community, it's hard to get a well educated doc or so it seems! But I do like the pediatrician, and she seems quite knowledgeable, so what do I ask? I am also going to the child psych on June 2nd. any advice what to say?

     
    Old 05-21-2008, 06:02 PM   #9
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    Jinxy,

    Even though the snoring has stopped. Does he still have chronic sinus ills and congestion? Allergies? How large are his tonsils and tongue? Does he have an elongated pallet? Look in on him when he sleeps and see if he mouth breathes.. if he does there is still obstruction some where...

    Tell your pediatrician you know a mother with sleep apnea and who has a five year old with obstructive sleep apnea and hypopnea. Tell her you have been concerned about your son's sleep patterns and this friend, Melissa a Navy brat, took note of all the symptoms and progressive changes in your son's sleep patterns and behavior. Given that your son had a history of sinus ills, currently is sleep walking, mouth breathing?, has an inability to sleep through the night with out waking up more than once, late onset ADHD type behavior, effect on school performance, can not stay awake in a motorized vehicle, and is unable to sit still with out falling asleep... your friend stated that every sign matched obstructive sleep apnea.. be it due to enlarged tonsils or a restricted airway. She also stressed that your pediatrician sounded thorough and caring and should see no reason not to explore such a serious condition fully with a sleep study, before your son has developmental issues and more severe sleep deprivation issues. She stressed that you go to your pediatrician to seek help in looking into sleep apnea in your son. Treatment is so simple. You might be able to correct it with a tonsillectomy or just by sleeping on a CPAP. Her son 5 has been on his CPAP for 1 year and 3 months and now sleeps solid 10+ hour nights with 1.5-2 hour naps each day! He is rested, exceptionally gifted and like any other child.. happy now.

    How does that sound? Good enough.
    MG
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    Old 05-22-2008, 04:25 AM   #10
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    To think us adults have it bad, just imagine what it's like for the children. They can't explain what's going on or wouldn't even think of explaining, whereas adults realise when something isn't right and attempt to do something about it.

    MG, you are fortunate in arming yourself with so much information and attitude when visiting your doctor's. I still come across a lot of people in my day to day life who have access to a computer, have certain health issues and simply do nothing about it. Their doctor says they are either fine or depressed, test results are fine, end of story. In this day and age with so much ready information available on the net i think everybody should at least go part way in fact gathering and presenting possibilities to their doctor or to use their researching in helping find a decent doctor.

    I think it also helps to have attitude and to not be too meek and soft and allow some arrogant, uninformed doctor stomp all over you and thereby giving you fear of doctors and fear of voicing your concerns and findings.

    I work with a girl who was virtually falling asleep at the wheel of her car whilst driving home. Her iron did get a bit low and i had to harrass her into seeing her doctor. The doctor didn't believe in iron supplementation and doesnt believe in vitamins. She told my work colleague that she was depressed. My friend, on my insistence, asked for iron supplements and the doctor gave her a script, but told her to ONLY take the supplement while she was having her menstrual cycle. Now that would really bring her iron levels up taking it 4 days per month!!!! Which cloud is this doctor on????

    Now this girl is always feeling the cold and even though her iron has now moved up, she is still tired and fortifying herself with coffee and chocolate in the afternoons to help keep her awake. I told her she ought to look into the thyroid/adrenal area, but she hasn't any interest. In the end i can't be bothered trying to make someone see sense that something is wrong, when you are a healthy young girl of 24 and can't stay awake till the end of the work day. I also asked her to get her thyroid tested and her doctor wouldn't do it saying that she is too young to have such a problem. I rest my case!!

    As for me and sleep problems........my bad sleep nights are random. No pattern. I simply go to bed and leave it up to the fates. Some nights i get good sleep, while others i fall asleep and wake up 4 hrs later and have difficult falling asleep and have disturbed sleep. I used to have no problems with sleeping years ago and then it went to 4 or 5 weeks of good sleep, then a week or 2 of bad sleep, then back to good, then back to bad. Now i'm all over the shop.

    As far as i know i don't have sleep apnea and believe it's to do with my thyroid issues or perhaps my adrenals, where my cortisol levels are running around at night and depleted by day. My ex husband did mention that i snore, but he says they are ladylike snores, more like a sort of purring, which i found hysterical, but at the end of the day, i think most of us make some sort of snoreyfied sounds while sleeping. If it were sleep apnea i'd say he would have complained of me waking him. Regardless, back then i didn't have the sleeping issues anyway.

    When i'd have a couple of nights of bad sleep i used to take valerian capsules to relax me. I found them useful.

    MG, you mentioned your cat, well now cats are an animal which truly knows how to relax. I think we could all take a leaf out of their book and we all might feel better for it.

     
    Old 05-22-2008, 04:54 AM   #11
    Audrey-B
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    One question.... i've often read about people experiencing certain thyroid related issues eg: muscle aches and pains, but certain issues appear to be related to people with depleted T4. I gather this means that people who need T4 med's would have a certain set of issues apart from the typical 'general' thyroid issues thyroid suffers across the board experience, while people on a T3 medication would have a seperate set of issues? or is that too cut and dried?

    As i am only on a T3 medication then that means that my T4 is reasonable, but my T3 is what is the problem?

    Second query regarding some informative articles on the net....... i came across some information which included the advice saying that if you were going to share any information with your doctor it should include sharing a copy of the British Medical Journal article that suggests a TSH value of over 2 may not be normal and respresents abnormal levels, which indicates a thyroid in the process of failing.

    Then there was a quarterly newsletter from the Thyroid Foundation of America called "The Bridge" and supposedly they are supposed to be at the "cutting edge of patient issues and advocacy".

    If such articles/journals etc as the above two exist and they are saying everything most of us know, why are doctors ignoring these facts? and thereby people going undiagnosed as i believe i was for likely 10 years, but at least for the last 7!!

     
    Old 05-22-2008, 06:37 AM   #12
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    IT is all a matter of being open to change Audrey. When you practice anything, why change just because a gaggle of scientist have doen a few surveys and tormented rats for years on end to determine that information prepared in the 60's is now invalid. Most MDs feel offended that a patient.. most who have less schooling than they do.. challenges their frame of reference and knowledge. It is the proverbial shot across the bow or glove to the face.. and THEN the fight is on! *images of knocking a particular Endo upside the head with a gauntlet, while thinking LOUDLY, "It's just a bunny! You are normal! SNAP OUT OF IT"*

    Whew! That is over. Back to point. In many cases it may be the MD hasn't had time to keep up with the latest research or reading.. then you get those that do not care. So my first tactic is really to try and be nice.. I have just as much education under my belt.. more in some cases than the MDs.. just not in the same field of expertise.. but the chemistry is quite handy with the endocrine mechanisms.. then I have two MDs in the family and three nurses and a lot of Ph.Ds. So we are always researching and digging up new information. If a family member has something, we all get involved to stay on top of things.. BECAUSE research is very progressive and fast paced in some fields. I just rambled again.. *SIGH, drives back on to the tracks.. BUMP BUMP.. sorry visualized a certain speed bump* So.. I let the MD know I have MDs in the family and am double checking everything with them and that we talk about my issues all the time. I will casually ask if they had read article such and such that is one of the hotter topics in endocrinology at the moment (pulling out said article).. what was their take on it. My SIL and I think this has potential and list facts and such. Same with my Neurologist friend. [I also play my more sympathetic specialists off on my less sympathetic ones in a similar fashion.] If this tactic and sharing the article with them doesn't change their mind.. I go for the avalanche method. They get hit with refereed publication after publication on every aspect of the condition followed by my blood work and such to show how it applies to me. If they drown under that tactic.. or run in terror.. I know I need to find a sturdier MD that is willing to learn and work with me.

    In my opinion as a teacher, you can not close yourself up in a box after you get your degree and say, " I know all I need to know and nothing else is left to BE LEARNED!" If that was the case, we would still be living in caves and wearing animal skins. Ohh! A real leather jacket or fur coat! Nope.. don't have um. *snaps me fingers*

    MG
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    Last edited by mkgb; 05-22-2008 at 06:42 AM.

     
    Old 05-22-2008, 10:03 AM   #13
    osteoblast
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    MG-I know you have had a busy week! At post 5 I asked a question about suppression therapy and mentioned The Thyroid Manager. My appt. with the ENT is tomorrow and I just needed to clear up a point. If people have thyroid cancer and a TT-then as a matter of course are they put on suppression therapy??
    If so, this is something I would have to avoid because of my severe osteoporosis.At thyroid manager it just talked about how suppression therapy would carry this risk for post-menopausal women.

     
    Old 05-22-2008, 10:58 AM   #14
    mkgb
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    Yes, Osteo. I hadn't forgotten your question it is in the list of things I am working on... This is what I had so far.

    SOP in thyroid cancer cases is to remove the thyroid tissue as much as one can.. then blast it with RAI.. then suppress the TSH.

    Now suppressing the TSH can be done with out throwing you hyperT. You just have to do it right. You can using T3 and T4 combination suppress your TSH and thus minimize the activation of any residual thyroid tissue with out loosing Ca and other essential minerals by beinf driven into hyper land. Most MDs are not willing to use T3 supplementation and push the T4 too far to achieve the same result.. thus you have issues with Osteoporosis aggravation.

    If a TT is done and there is no cancer present TSH suppression is not in the mandated care.

    MG
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    Last edited by mkgb; 05-22-2008 at 11:00 AM.

     
    Old 05-22-2008, 11:05 AM   #15
    mkgb
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    Re: Thyroid Care and Concerns Around the World - Week 6!

    I am seeing so many with T4 to T3 conversion issuesbe it too high T4 and too low T3 to the reverse anomaly too low T4 and too high T3. So I have done some digging and am going to try to simplify it! Yeah, go Geek! It turned out to be three pages so.. here is my first multi-post lecture

    PART ONE: T4 to T3 - Conversion Control Factors
    Well let us start with the statement of the obvious, conversion of T4 to T3 is a crucial step in the process of thyroid function. If this step is deficient or altered in any way the individual will suffer with symptoms of low thyroid and in severe cases hypoT and hyperT symptoms! How many of you out there are with me on this? No need to type a replies I hear the shouts! What could cause you to be a dysfunctional T4 to T3 converter, well it may be part life style and not just the pesky endocrine system!
    1) Starvation – extreme diets are not good, you must eat a balanced meal set and just cut the junk.. moderation and exercise are the key over deprivation!
    2) Diabetes – Once again diet and exercise and general good life style can help both the thyroid and your diabetic state.
    3) Uremia (excessive amounts of urea in the blood – associated with kidney disease or failure) and other chronic debilitating conditions and diseases.
    4) Nutrient deficiencies, most notably selenium. Also, zinc, glutathione, cobalt, vitamin D and riboflavin deficiencies have been implicated into low T4 to T3 conversion.. so if you are taking too much of these you may drive your conversion rate out of balance! When taking supplements you must check you levels to insure that you are not getting too much of a GOOD thing.
    5) High Carbohydrate diets – being on insulin for diabetes, steriods for adrenal issues, or thyroid meds we have to go low on processed carbs. We have to go whole grains and fruit and veggies to meet our needs. The meds we take make us more susceptible and sensitive to breads, pastas, and quick carbohydrate fuels.
    6) Diets LOW in protein and HIGH in fats can interfere with the thyroid function. Fat has been found to be antagonistic to thyroid function and lowers metabolism. The best diet we can strive for is the cave man diet as my MD put it... If you can not kill it and eat it, pick it and eat it. You do not need it. Cut out the processed foods and drinks. Sniff I love bread, and pasta, and chocolate, and SODA.. carbonation is my bane! Sorry I am back.
    7) Stress and the increased cortisol response (no matter what we have to chill.. keep it on the down low and say go jump in a lake to the Mds and those that try and disturb our HAPPY place: Too much stress = too much cortisol which will increase weight gain and suppress T4 to t3 conversion.)

    Specifics on T4 to T3 synthesis mechanisms:
    1.Thyroid hormone is made from a protein call TYROSINE. Tyrosine is made by converting phenalalinine, another protein, into tyrosine. This is done USING IRON. If iron is low, this will not occur. So we must detect and treat our anemias!

    2.Once Tyrosine is made, it goes to the thyroid gland. The mineral Mn (Manganese) is then used to help convert Tyrosine into thyroxine. Thyroxine is also called T4. Iodine is an integral part of this process four are needed for each T4 molecule.. if you are too low in iodine you will go hypoT.. too high and you will be driven hyperT.

    3.Once Thyroxine is made, it goes to the liver(and Kidney's and other tissue.. but the liver handles 80% of the traffic). Some of it is set aside and is called reserve T4 or used directly as T4 in neurological nerve function and more. In the liver, T4 is changed to T3 by the stripping of an iodine atom. I an outer iodine is removed you get what you need T3 if an inner one is striped you get the inactive form of T3 known as rT3. T3 is actually the hormone the body uses for most physical processes. This conversion is dependent on Zn (Zinc) and Se (Selenium). Excessive levels of copper and mercury in your system will interfere with this conversion.

    4.Once converted to T3, the body can now use this hormone and party hard like it was 1999...when the T3 is used up.. the cycle begins again. Make T4 ,ship it out, convert, and PARTY!

    5.Once in the cell, the mineral Se(Selenium) helps once more in the actual hormone function. Low levels of the mineral selenium will cause inactivity of the T3 hormone. High levels will cause and over activity of T3. Se and B12 also help in the production of one enzyme involved in the conversion of T4 to T3.
    __________________
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