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Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

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Old 02-06-2009, 12:14 PM   #1
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Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

I had repeat lab work done 2 weeks after being in the ER. Labs from the ER revealed a TSH of 4.3 (ULN 4.2). I got my results today, TSH 1.41 (.4-4.5), quite a drop in two weeks, FT4 1.3 ((.8-1.8), it was 1.47 two weeks ago, T3 total 132 (97-219), I know he ordered the FT3 but can't find it on my lab copies, TPO 11 (less than 20), thyroglobulin antibodies less than 20, TSI 80 (less than 125). I have never had a TSI before. Also, interestingly, cholesterol has dropped 33 points in the last 7 months from 221 to 188, no meds, the year before it was 210. The MD thinks I had a viral episode. He also addressed the frees not corresponding correctly to the TSH, he mentioned hormone resistance. We are just going to follow for now and I am satisfied with that. He wants all these studies run again in four weeks due to the swings. Is a TSI of 80 okay?

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Old 02-06-2009, 02:14 PM   #2
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Re: Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

Sparkie.....................when you have the thyrogobulin Ab's and also the TSI antibodies you most likely have hashitoxocisis. You are probably hypo with TSI antibodies. This makes your numbers swing up and down. Go to the search bar at the top right of home page and type in "hashitoxocisis" and you can get a lot of information. Read my post there.

I have hashimoto's and also have TSI antibodies. Also read post by mellymermaid.

Old 02-07-2009, 06:07 AM   #3
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Re: Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

SHMILY, well, this was something I never expected. The TPO hasn't changed in three years though. Perhaps this explains that while I continue to shed hair like crazy, it also grows very fast, along with my this a possibility? I will have repeat labs done in a month. Actually I only saw the FT4 on the lab sheet, not the FT3 which surprises me because he talked about the frees a lot. (sigh) I really thought I had found the perfect MD. I really like him though. He does have a great understanding of how the thyroid works and he is not too arrogant to state that there are still a lot of things we don't understand. So, with a TSI of 80 and normal being up to 125, is this just something to keep an eye on for now? Except for this last 4-week episode, I feel pretty well with the exception of clocking out early in the evening.

Old 02-07-2009, 10:26 AM   #4
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Re: Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

You probably will not have symptoms of Graves with a tsi of 80. I had them at 109. Any tsi isn't normal so it does show you have the antibodies for it. In the future you could switch to Graves, or not if you have more blocking antibodies. I think you need a TBII to determine that or a TRab test.

Old 02-19-2009, 07:21 PM   #5
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Re: Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

What are the tests/or labs to determine Graves markers???
What are the normal/vs abnormal levels?

Old 02-20-2009, 07:02 AM   #6
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Re: Is TSI a Grave's marker? What do you make of this.

A TSI of 80 will effect your thyroid function.. but it isn't high enough to classify you as Graves. I have TSI levels over 120.. in addition to TPOAb levels in the 1000's. But then my immune system always does things in a big way. I get Graves and Hashimoto's symptoms.

Now it has been documented that Graves patients or Hashimoto's patients with their compromised immune systems often develop the opposing thyroid AI condition as a means of self-defense. It is odd but in some their system seems to recognize that destroying the thyroid tissue is resulting in a decrease in thyroid hormone function. The system also realizes that the TSH trigger of TPO and TG T4 production and transport mechanism is causing said destruction to occur at a higher rate. Developing the Graves trait TSI (thyroid stimulating immuglobulins) is a back door method around the TSH.

I concur that given your presence of autoimmune antibodies for both Graves and Hashimoto's that you should check the secondary TRAb graves marker. Your swing from hypoT to normal may just be a result of Hashitoxicosis. The fancy name for a Graves-Hashimoto's terf war over you thyroid. In the end people with Hashimoto's and Graves antibodies end up with a dead thyroid and classified as just being Hashimoto's... or at least that is what four Endos have told me. I had two Endos that ignored my Graves all together because my Hashimoto's was som dominant over the Graves. However I do have mild thyroid eye disease... which the non-Graves acknowledgers just say is the result of a rare Hashimoto's interaction. *snort* Whatever. I am not using an Endon't at the moment. I actually like forward progress in my thyroid, adrenal, PCOS, IR, and reactive hypoglycemia treatment.


ANY presence of thyroid antibodies be they Graves of Hashimoto's is abnormal immune function. However clinical positive Hashimoto's and Graves standards are based on statistical averaging of known antibody levels in patients with Hashi's or Graves that show positive symptoms. So you have to look at the presence of antibodies in addition to symptoms. If the symptoms are there and antibodies are present.. it is PROBABLE that said patient has Hashimoto's or Graves. Diagnosis is not black or white.. there is a LOT of grey in it.

Hashimoto's antibody tests are TPOAb and TGAb ranges vary between laboratories
Graves antibody markers TSI and TRAb ranges vary between labs as well. With Graves however studies show that remission in over 90% of active Graves patients doesn't occur until the TSI levels fall below 25 on a positive scale of 125. Many will have an immediate re-emergence of symptoms if antibody levels are between 100-125 and ATDs are withdrawn.
If we learn by our mistakes, I am working on one hell of an education.

Last edited by mkgbrook; 02-20-2009 at 07:08 AM.

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