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    Old 04-25-2004, 02:36 AM   #1
    WratherBsleepin
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    Angry Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    I'm a 22 year old male, diagnosed with ADHD when I was about 15. I was put on ritilan, but it had no positive effects, so I stopped taking it. I didn't see a doctor again until I was 19 or 20, but it wasn't for ADHD, it was because I was having panic attacks. The doctor believed the panic attacks branched from the ADHD, and put me on Adderall, hoping to fix 2 problems at once. (ADHD and Panic attacks)
    The adderall took effect immediatly and I haven't had a panic attack since, not to mention improved in other areas of my life that were being affected by the ADHD. I've been on adderall for a little over 2 years. (Not the time released)

    Now to the Tourette's. I remember as a kid, 7-8 years old I guess, I had what my parents thought was just a silly habbit. I would make a sound that was something like a " HMPH" quite often. And I would also "roll" my eyes. It never got bad enough to cause much attention, and eventually I stopped on my own.
    I cant remember having any more symptoms until I was about 18 years old. I started "chewing" on the insides of my cheeks. I dont know what purpose it served, but it went from an every now and then thing, to a really annoying habbit that I to this day haven't been able to stop. For the first year or more I got pretty bad about it. I did it ALOT. I've gained some control over it, but i still do it, just not as often, and its not nearly as noticable as it used to be.
    The problem is, while I was able to reduce the cheek biting, several months ago I started this damn eye thing. I feel the need to "stretch" my eyes. It's just a very slight movement that isn't even noticible to others, but annoys the hell out of me because I can't help but to do it. I can stop the cheek biting if i think about it, but this is almost beyond my control. It's almost non stop. I've noticed that if I take my glasses off, it seems to help quite a bit. (I've got a stigmatism in both eyes) So taking my glasses off isn't really an option unless im not doing anything which requires me to see, which isn't often.

    What I want to know is- Is there any way to "break" my self of this non sense without having to take a prescription medication?
    I've heard that adderall tends to worsen tourette's symptoms, but I can't say I notice much difference, if any, with or without the adderall. The cheek biting started before the adderall.
    What can I expect as far as progression with tourette's? Is this something that normally worsen's over time, or possibly improves?
    As you can see, I'm pretty positive I have tourette's, although I've never been diagnosed, or even mentioned it to my doctor. So basically I'm just looking for anyone that may have some good advice how to find relief from the symptoms (without medication). Im already on adderall, thats enough for me. If it were only ADHD, I wouldn't even take the adderall. I just can't deal with the panic attacks. Anything that makes those things go away is a miracle in my book.

    Any advice would be appreciated! THANKS!

     
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    Old 04-27-2004, 08:24 PM   #2
    firebug31
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Hey Wrather

    It is true that Stims make Tics worse. Meds for TS are very controversial and most people tend to not go there. Some good sites to check out are
    TS+ is fun
    Lifes a twitchTSA.com

    Hey the other reason I hit your post is you said you've been on adderal for two years. I am on Adderal XR for one year now and I have a question? Have you experienced a change in libito or experienced any impotence?

     
    Old 04-28-2004, 12:10 PM   #3
    Jennita
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by WratherBsleepin
    I'm a 22 year old male, diagnosed with ADHD when I was about 15. I was put on ritilan, but it had no positive effects, so I stopped taking it. I didn't see a doctor again until I was 19 or 20, but it wasn't for ADHD, it was because I was having panic attacks. The doctor believed the panic attacks branched from the ADHD, and put me on Adderall, hoping to fix 2 problems at once. (ADHD and Panic attacks)
    The adderall took effect immediatly and I haven't had a panic attack since, not to mention improved in other areas of my life that were being affected by the ADHD. I've been on adderall for a little over 2 years. (Not the time released)

    Now to the Tourette's. I remember as a kid, 7-8 years old I guess, I had what my parents thought was just a silly habbit. I would make a sound that was something like a " HMPH" quite often. And I would also "roll" my eyes. It never got bad enough to cause much attention, and eventually I stopped on my own.
    I cant remember having any more symptoms until I was about 18 years old. I started "chewing" on the insides of my cheeks. I dont know what purpose it served, but it went from an every now and then thing, to a really annoying habbit that I to this day haven't been able to stop. For the first year or more I got pretty bad about it. I did it ALOT. I've gained some control over it, but i still do it, just not as often, and its not nearly as noticable as it used to be.
    The problem is, while I was able to reduce the cheek biting, several months ago I started this damn eye thing. I feel the need to "stretch" my eyes. It's just a very slight movement that isn't even noticible to others, but annoys the hell out of me because I can't help but to do it. I can stop the cheek biting if i think about it, but this is almost beyond my control. It's almost non stop. I've noticed that if I take my glasses off, it seems to help quite a bit. (I've got a stigmatism in both eyes) So taking my glasses off isn't really an option unless im not doing anything which requires me to see, which isn't often.

    What I want to know is- Is there any way to "break" my self of this non sense without having to take a prescription medication?
    I've heard that adderall tends to worsen tourette's symptoms, but I can't say I notice much difference, if any, with or without the adderall. The cheek biting started before the adderall.
    What can I expect as far as progression with tourette's? Is this something that normally worsen's over time, or possibly improves?
    As you can see, I'm pretty positive I have tourette's, although I've never been diagnosed, or even mentioned it to my doctor. So basically I'm just looking for anyone that may have some good advice how to find relief from the symptoms (without medication). Im already on adderall, thats enough for me. If it were only ADHD, I wouldn't even take the adderall. I just can't deal with the panic attacks. Anything that makes those things go away is a miracle in my book.

    Any advice would be appreciated! THANKS!
    The cheek biting did start after you were prescribed Ritalin according to your post. Ritalin can cause tics such as that. Discontinuing Ritalin may have seemed easy at the time, but maybe those panic attacks later on could have been the result of taking Ritalin.

    From what I understand, the brain can have cravings for addictive drugs like Ritalin for many years after discontinuation......that's why people have relapses who have tried to get off addictive drugs, whatever that drug might have been (uppers, downers, etc.)

    The fact that Adderall got rid of your panic makes me suspect it is a brain craving because the number one drug for panic attacks is usually something like Xanax, (which is also an addictive drug), not Adderall. It's like you satisfied your brain's craving with what it was asking for.....it was in panic for Ritalin, but Adderall is nearly the same so it served the purpose.

    Well, hey, I'm no expert but have read alot about this stuff.

    So basically, you are on speed....controlled dosing by your doctor, but, it's still speed. Sure, it helps you focus, but the progression of such drugs is eventual tolerance. Tolerance calls for higher doses. Higher doses then will damage the brain/body. Amphetamines are linked to causing depression after long term use as well. Look up the drug prescription info on Adderall's adverse effects to see how it is bad for heart, kidneys, etc.

    Maybe slowly tapering off and then finding ways to deal with any future panic other than drugs that may pop up could work. Or you can keep taking amphetamines and just put up with the tics and other health problems that may arise in the future. It's really up to you.

    As far as getting rid of tics, I've heard discontinuing the drugs solve that problem for alot of people, but, sometimes they can be permanent.

    Those things you did as a kid, the "HMPH!" and rolling of eyes does not sound like a tic but just normal kid stuff. Maybe you saw someone do that and you were just imitating it....you know, I recall that as being a common way actors' used to exhibit disgust towards something/someone.

    Heres' my thing: I used to put my hands on my hips as a kid and say "So I am!". Made no sense; have no idea why I did that. Kids pick up alot of funny sayings, noises and gestures...imitation is a form of learning I suppose.

    Anyway, Good luck in whatever you decide...

     
    Old 05-10-2004, 03:04 PM   #4
    WratherBsleepin
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by firebug31
    Hey Wrather

    It is true that Stims make Tics worse. Meds for TS are very controversial and most people tend to not go there. Some good sites to check out are
    TS+ is fun
    Lifes a twitchTSA.com

    Hey the other reason I hit your post is you said you've been on adderal for two years. I am on Adderal XR for one year now and I have a question? Have you experienced a change in libito or experienced any impotence?
    Thanks for the links. I'll check them out. After I posted this, I actually have been getting much better about the eye rolling thing. I still do it once in a while, but it seems to be gradually fading ( with some effort on my part )

    For your questions, the answer is yes to both. The desire was a major problem for the first year or so, and still isn't completely back to normal, but it has improved alot over the past year. When I first started taking adderall, the want just wasn't there (even during sex) . But I believe it was more of a side effect that slowly improved over time.
    As for the impotence, that was a problem for about the same amount of time as the libido. Which also improved with time. Which isn't comepletely back to "normal" for sure, but isn't nearly as bad as it was during the first year of taking adderall.. If I don't take adderall for a day, there is definately a big difference in both libido and impotence. Its almost like taking one of those
    "All night long" pills. lol, seriously though.
    The problem that is quite annoying and frustrates me sometimes is that I can't go nearly as long as I used to during sex while taking adderall.. Which is definately caused by the adderall because if I dont take it, theres a huge difference in time length. 5-10 minutes on adderall vs. 45+ minutes without adderall.

     
    Old 05-10-2004, 03:26 PM   #5
    WratherBsleepin
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jennita
    The cheek biting did start after you were prescribed Ritalin according to your post. Ritalin can cause tics such as that. Discontinuing Ritalin may have seemed easy at the time, but maybe those panic attacks later on could have been the result of taking Ritalin.

    From what I understand, the brain can have cravings for addictive drugs like Ritalin for many years after discontinuation......that's why people have relapses who have tried to get off addictive drugs, whatever that drug might have been (uppers, downers, etc.)

    The fact that Adderall got rid of your panic makes me suspect it is a brain craving because the number one drug for panic attacks is usually something like Xanax, (which is also an addictive drug), not Adderall. It's like you satisfied your brain's craving with what it was asking for.....it was in panic for Ritalin, but Adderall is nearly the same so it served the purpose.

    Well, hey, I'm no expert but have read alot about this stuff.

    So basically, you are on speed....controlled dosing by your doctor, but, it's still speed. Sure, it helps you focus, but the progression of such drugs is eventual tolerance. Tolerance calls for higher doses. Higher doses then will damage the brain/body. Amphetamines are linked to causing depression after long term use as well. Look up the drug prescription info on Adderall's adverse effects to see how it is bad for heart, kidneys, etc.

    Maybe slowly tapering off and then finding ways to deal with any future panic other than drugs that may pop up could work. Or you can keep taking amphetamines and just put up with the tics and other health problems that may arise in the future. It's really up to you.

    As far as getting rid of tics, I've heard discontinuing the drugs solve that problem for alot of people, but, sometimes they can be permanent.

    Those things you did as a kid, the "HMPH!" and rolling of eyes does not sound like a tic but just normal kid stuff. Maybe you saw someone do that and you were just imitating it....you know, I recall that as being a common way actors' used to exhibit disgust towards something/someone.

    Heres' my thing: I used to put my hands on my hips as a kid and say "So I am!". Made no sense; have no idea why I did that. Kids pick up alot of funny sayings, noises and gestures...imitation is a form of learning I suppose.

    Anyway, Good luck in whatever you decide...
    I didn't take ritilan long enough to become addicted. I only took it for MAYBE 1 week at most, and discontinued it with no withdrawls or side effects at all.
    The panic attacks came out of no wheres, on their own with no real explanation. Which isn't uncommon. My girlfriend also experiences them, my nephew, and I've met quite a few other people that also have panic attacks with no prior drug history what so ever.

    I am well aware of the possibility of harmful effects from adderall, but there are side effects, and dangers, with any prescription, and even non prescription medication. These are chances we take in order to help/heal our selves when our bodies/minds aren't doing their job. When we are in pain that is too severe to deal with, we have to take pain medication. It's not by choice. I strongly believe that there are certainly way too many drugs on the prescription market these days, and that too many people look for an easy way out of dealing with life's little problems, however, there are people that DO infact need medication to balance unbalanced brain chemicals. ADHD is not a myth, its a brain disorder which needs treatment, and sometimes the old " tough it out" tactic just isn't enough. Panic attacks, anxiety disorders, tourette syndrome, etc..etc.. are all very real, and in severe cases need medication just like many other problems that as humans, we tend to "develope", and sometimes CAUSE. Either way though, medication is most often the only "answer" there is.
    Believe me when I tell you, I would much wrather NOT have to take medicine to function normally. But when faced with a REAL disorder, medication is a blessing.

    Last edited by WratherBsleepin; 05-10-2004 at 03:28 PM.

     
    Old 05-10-2004, 03:37 PM   #6
    crillmom
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Wratherbsleeping. I love your response to the person who was speaking negatively about medication, I have a son who has adhd and major anxiey With medication he is able to live a full and satisfying life, I could not have said it better myself.

     
    Old 05-10-2004, 08:56 PM   #7
    Jennita
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by WratherBsleepin
    I didn't take ritilan long enough to become addicted. I only took it for MAYBE 1 week at most, and discontinued it with no withdrawls or side effects at all.
    The panic attacks came out of no wheres, on their own with no real explanation. Which isn't uncommon. My girlfriend also experiences them, my nephew, and I've met quite a few other people that also have panic attacks with no prior drug history what so ever.

    I am well aware of the possibility of harmful effects from adderall, but there are side effects, and dangers, with any prescription, and even non prescription medication. These are chances we take in order to help/heal our selves when our bodies/minds aren't doing their job. When we are in pain that is too severe to deal with, we have to take pain medication. It's not by choice. I strongly believe that there are certainly way too many drugs on the prescription market these days, and that too many people look for an easy way out of dealing with life's little problems, however, there are people that DO infact need medication to balance unbalanced brain chemicals. ADHD is not a myth, its a brain disorder which needs treatment, and sometimes the old " tough it out" tactic just isn't enough. Panic attacks, anxiety disorders, tourette syndrome, etc..etc.. are all very real, and in severe cases need medication just like many other problems that as humans, we tend to "develope", and sometimes CAUSE. Either way though, medication is most often the only "answer" there is.
    Believe me when I tell you, I would much wrather NOT have to take medicine to function normally. But when faced with a REAL disorder, medication is a blessing.
    There is still the issue of tics. Stimulants will worsen them like the other poster said.

    ADD itself is real, but is it really a biological disease or mental disorder as it is defined? Many people disagree; it is a different learning brain that has a hard time with conventional teaching some feel. Look up visual-spartial learners for a different point of view.

    Also, there is no proof you are deficient in dopamine. What is the level or measure that is normal? Have you had your levels tested? The answer is, no, they don't have a measure of what's normal, nor do they know your levels.

    This is not like diabetes....diabetes can be measured accurately through blood testing; blood sugar levels must be monitored by the diabetic throughout the day for proper insulin intake. Also, nobody builds tolerance to diabetes medication like they do to stimulant drugs.

    The biological connection to ADD as being a disease can not be proven. Since they discovered that amphetamines speed up thinking processes and heighten focus through dopamine, they assumed that people who aren't so sharp are deficent in dopamine....thus it is based on theory, not fact.

    But believe what you want. I hope all goes well mental/physically health-wise for you, but your body will ultimately have the say in time. Hopefully, you will not build tolerance to fast as to avoid the higher doses which may lead to health problems. These drugs are very toxic to the brain.

    Did you know that neurotransmitters are virtually made from protein synthesis? Yes, protein breaks down into amino acids; amino acids create various neurotransmitters needed for the brain. So, healthy eating and vitamins/supplements are very important.

    Alot of people have also sworn by tutors. My brother-in-law, who was diagnoised, had a tutor because his mother did not like drugs. This did help him and later on in life, he went on to get his college degree. It is possible to use other means to get through the learning process.

    Please do consider this if negative effects of your med happen to you later on. Best of luck

    Last edited by Jennita; 05-10-2004 at 09:03 PM.

     
    Old 05-15-2004, 09:42 PM   #8
    firebug31
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    Hey WRather

    Thanks for the reply. I talked to the pshycoligist the other day and he acted surprised to hear of any impotence with Adderal like it was weird I would even bring it up. I have done some research though and everything I have found on Adderal states that this is a possible side effect so I thgouth it weird that he would react as he did. I know it has to be the adderal. I suppose I could do like you and take a break from it to see if I get results but I am going through a divorce right now so there is no real urgent need for the dude to perform right now. LOL

    I appreciate the reply it seems once you go down this road with a thread people shy away from replying. It makes me feel much better to hear someone else is have ing the same effects.

    Glad to hear the tics have lessened. Thing is do read the links I gave you. It's called Wax and Waneing or complex word for getting better or worse. Tics will get better and worse due to many things. Stress being a big one typoically make sthem worse but they will wax and wane just because. To be diagnosed with TS that is one of the criteria that your tics do wax and wane. The other thing is you may actually go periods with no tics for as long as a few months and poof they are back.

    The absolute best med for tics and TS is to read read read and learn about it. The more you understand it the better it seems it is to deal with.

    Thanks again

     
    Old 05-16-2004, 11:24 AM   #9
    northernlights2
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    Re: Tourette's Syndrome/ADHD

    hi guys...just had to jump in here about tourette's syndrome...

    my daughter is 24 now and was diagnosed with both ADD and Tourette's syndrome when she was 10. she has never taken any form of med for either. but i can tell you that the tics DO wax and wane from time to time easing off considerably to coming back with a vengence for no reason. stress aggravates them. they do ease in severity as you age, however tend to stabablize after the age of about 21. my daughters tics were never that severe, but did annoy her. eye blinking, tensing of shoulders, making that wierd throat-clearing sound, were some of her biggies. she still suffers from the eye-blinking and throat-clearing to this day but it comes and goes. she's used to it and tells people not to mention it to her or it will get worse. and she's right..calling attention to the tics only excasperates them. and to people who ask you why you just can't knock it off..tell them to try and not blink..ever. that will give them a taste of what the compulsion is like.

     
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