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    Old 11-18-2003, 10:14 AM   #16
    DonutsNCoffee
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by xxFreakOfNaturexx
    i thought *all* guys cheated though...at least one way or another. i play video games a minimum of about 3 hr/day...doesn't mean i'm lazy or ignorant though. but if i'm allowed to be sexist, high school boys are complete morons, so you're right about that...
    Not all of us guys cheat. I've never cheated. Been cheated on once, but never cheated myself.

    Nothing wrong with playing video games. Problem with most 14 years is that's all they know.

    Yes, high school boys are morons, which is why you shouldn't be in a rush to find a boyfriend. Wait til they finish growing up first.

     
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    Old 11-18-2003, 11:13 AM   #17
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    let me please clarify, I never said you were "insane". You just seem to really have a lack of self confidence, which is why I suggested talking to someone. You are like any other teenager who is just struggling to be happy with themselves. I think we all understand.Trust me, I've been where you are... well, never as skinny as you, but where you think "it won't help if I talk to anyone". I've tried to fix my self esteem problems on my own and it's never really worked.

    Also, I just did the math and I figured out that your BMI (body mass index) is 17. Your normal HEALTHY BMI should be 20-25. You are considered severely underweight. Also, I figured out that at your height and age, you should weigh AT LEAST 110 lbs. You are almost 15 lbs under the suggested weight. THIS is why I say you are too skinny and that this is causing your stomach to stick out.

    You posted because you wanted help, correct? But you have shot down every suggestion made to you. Perhaps the fact that we all have given you similar advice and you continue to fight it, should tell you that the problem may lie within YOU, not how you look.

     
    Old 11-18-2003, 06:51 PM   #18
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    I have been biting my tongue... but I think I have to agree with this last post by Notorious... I am just really sad for you....You seem to be angry at everyone, and you ask for help but shoot down what is suggested. I'm not, and I'm sure no one else is, trying to be hurtful, but being able to fit into a certain size, or look a certain way is not going to get rid of your anger or make you happy.
    You may like how you look better then but with the way you seem to feel, it won't make you like yourself any better- not trying to criticize you, but you sound like you see nothing good in life. I wish there was a way to make you see what I think all of us are seeing in your words.
    In regards to what you said about "guys would be less likely to cheat on me"... hate to break it to you, but the guys who do cheat (and they are NOT the majority!!) would cheat on you if you looked like a goddess- I have a friend who is drop-dead GORGEOUS and her hubby cheated on her over and over again... and often with women who didn't look anywhere near as good.
    As far as "unless you wanna talk about carbs, carboHYDRATEs, which means you lose WATER and water only when you cut them out..." you don't just lose water when you cut down on carbs... unless some of us are running around with 20+excess lbs of water!!! I have lost inches and weight since cutting down carbs, and probably about the first 5 lbs was water! The rest has been fat.
    Anyhow, I hope you can get out of your mindset, and start feeling more positive about yourself and your life.
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    Old 11-19-2003, 07:21 AM   #19
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    I think what is interesting is how weight and happiness go together... Sure, when you are over-weight, sometimes you are unhappy. (that is a direct correlation) But it doesn't work that way for being skinny... I mean, even after you lose the weight, it never seems to be enough, you still aren't happy. You always think, "well, just 5 more lbs" or something like that.

    Unless you find something within yourself to be happy about, you will never be satisfied with your body/weight. ESPECIALLY since your body weight will fluctuate during your life time. I mean, you are only 15, you still have to go through the stress of driving, going to college, finding a major, graduating, etc... and that is GOING to change your body, it's pretty much a proven fact.

     
    Old 11-20-2003, 02:17 PM   #20
    xxFreakOfNaturexx
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    in response to what alot of people have said about me being "angry at everyone" honestly it's just that i'm emotionally exhausted from [insert stepdad's 'issue' with me here]. that will not be a problem when i'm 16 though, like i said before i'm getting an apartment in 10 mos. i don't understand why that's so unusual, i know ppl who have done that as well...please don't say i 'need help' as none of you know me...and every time i have seen a psychiatrist/psyclologist they have basically told me "that's NOT okay, you're a BAD BAD GIRL!!!"--they scold me for things i entrusted them enough to tell them. and it's nothing that could 'hurt myself or others' either. honestly it's like they get off from harrassing people...that is why i don't trust them. not just 1, or 2, or 3, we're talking at LEAST 5 or 6 who have done this to me. please believe me, someone just listen to me when i say this: my "anger" comes from my stepdad, so when i am away from him i won't feel like i'm constantly being challenged, constantly wrong, constantly labeled a liar, constantly being verbally harrassed. oh, btw EVERY girl feels bad about the way they look. this does NOT make me insane, as i do NOT have an eating 'disorder,' i do not take diet pills, and i eat healthy meals and healthy quantities!! please END your begging me to 'seek help!' seriously now i have 'seeked help' from age 7 to age 14 and it never did a damn thing...my mother actually said psychiatrists/ologists did far more harm than good. settled now?! please? out of my personal life and back on topic?

    for everyone who says i have 'shot down every suggestion' that is BS. i have 'shot down' counselors because i have been mistreated several times by them. i 'shot down' vegetables because i can't stand the taste. i 'shot down' loving myself, because a big cheesey grin isn't gonna change what is shown in the mirror.

    what i did NOT 'shoot down' is: chiropractor-getting 1 next month. vitamins-this weekend. eating 5-6 small meals, aka 'grazing'-this is day 2 of that approach and i honestly think i am losing inches already somehow. eat more fruit-happily done. tell guys that harrass me about my body to go f*** themselves-maybe those exact words weren't recommended, but it's the same concept.
    advice taken: guys will cheat no matter what. anyone who doesn't love me right now doesn't want me for me. stop focusing all your energy on guys. a woman's 'journey for a perfect body' never ends...

    see, i'm not as selfish and annoying as you ppl think.

    Last edited by xxFreakOfNaturexx; 11-20-2003 at 02:41 PM.

     
    Old 11-21-2003, 09:42 AM   #21
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    Unfortunately, in things like message boards and email, it is very hard to express your feelings and get the tone across to everyone else. What one person says and how someone else takes it are very different, which is probably happening with us misunderstanding what you mean and vice versa.

    I will get back on topic and still say that the fact that you are vegan and don't like vegetables does not make sense to me. is there a particular reason why you're a vegan? when i was my lowest weight, i had a chicken breast for dinner almost every night. (i wish i could do that again, but meat grosses me out) You could always think about slowly adding animal by-products back into your diet (and please note that when i say "diet" i do not mean you are ON a diet, i just mean your actual diet), it seems like that might work. That way you would cut out some carbs. (you may not think that carbs are bad, but what you don't use in energy turns into sugar. and if that's the case, you might as well just eat some candy. that's what i'd do! )

    I think we have all responded to your statements because a) we've been there b) we care about your well-being c) most of us are older than you are and have more experience in eating and things.

    Please know that NO ONE has said you are psycho or insane for this problem. You ARE right that most girls go through this. But we are just trying to help you stop it before the obsession does real harm. (here, i speak from personal experience)

     
    Old 11-21-2003, 11:55 AM   #22
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    >>I will get back on topic and still say that the fact that you are vegan and don't like vegetables does not make sense to me. is there a particular reason why you're a vegan? when i was my lowest weight, i had a chicken breast for dinner almost every night.<<

    i used to eat chicken at least twice a day--my teacher said i was malnutritioned b/c i wasn't eating meat, and if i ate poultry i'd get a flat stomach. i didn't exactly love putting a bird on a plate, but i held strong to the belief that it would make me look better. it didn't.
    i didn't just one day wake up and decide to be vegan because it's 'cool,' because 'i'll lose weight' or whatever. i tried to make myself a chicken breast but threw it away, as i could no longer stand to take these lives vainly trying to make mine better. an it harm none, do what ye will. well, i think if you consume anything that is a product of suffering, rape and slaughter...that's definitely considered harm. another reason i am vegan.
    also, some studies have proven that *eliminating* meat and animal products helps some people "lose weight effortlessly." very seriously, a playboy bunny supports that theory. [i believe she's called the leaf lady or something? she's on peta's site.] so science has said it is helpful, and so has 1 of my idols. good enough for me.
    i think meat and fake-meat have the *same* weight-modifying properties, and eating meat will not make me look any different that when i eat imitations. meats have the carcinogens from processing, the fat, the cholesterol. fake-meats have sodium and carbs. and i'd much rather live life a vegan than live hating myself further and fearing damnation o_O;;

    >>what you don't use in energy turns into sugar. and if that's the case, you might as well just eat some candy. that's what i'd do! <<
    ...i *do* give in to laffy taffy or other low-cal vegan sweets every once in a while...okay, every few days. i'm trying to break the habit though!! if i can only learn to cook with stevia...*just ate 2 laffy-taffy's and a wolf bar* hey, at least i'm helping save wildlife when i indulge.
    i don't usually eat like this, but today was grocery day.

    while we are talking about sugar, will sugar-free candy help you flatten your stomach, or will the sweeteners have the same effect as sugar? like i said, i can't cook worth half a s***...so stevia is out of the question, unless they manufacture stevia candy.

     
    Old 11-21-2003, 02:08 PM   #23
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    Try Splenda (sucralose) sweetner. You can bake with it and it doesn't change it's flavor.

    I think we should just leave you alone to your self pitying, narcissistic desires to be a "stripper, playboybunny, sexkitten WHATEVER" which is obviously what your sole desire in life is to be. You'll get your wish, I'm sure, and when you're dying of some sexually transmitted disease at the age of 17 or 18 from one of the many "boyfriends" you just "gotta" have, maybe you'll actually listen to some of these honestly helpful people who are trying to give you a little well meant advice.

    You won't take any advice unless it's "easy" enough for you AND if it gets you your damn "FLAT STOMACH". I mean...This whole thread is total BS. You are so single mindedly interested in ONLY ONE THING. HOW YOU LOOK. There is a whole world out there with men who don't give a rip about whether a girl has a "flat stomach" or not. The ones who DO care about flat stomachs are PRECISELY THE ONES WHO WILLLLLLLL CHEAT ON YOU!!!!! AND YET THAT"S WHAT YOU WANT??? You have TOTALLY bought into the stereo typical image of the twiggy "model" type. It's about MATERIALISM and SEX and that is it FOR YOU. You are COMPLETELY SHALLOW (from what I hear). And this is SOOO sad because you're only 15. But then you do sound your age (younger?).

    Your parents must have TOTALLY MESSED YOU UP MENTALLY. And you will never get help because "nobody knows what they're talking about" except YOU. So why bother asking for advice...no one's advice is good enough... unless they know of a fairy godmother who can make your tummy flat.

    And you don't like veggies? Try to grow up and EAT THEM ANYWAY. ALmost no one grows up liking veggies. You eat them because they are what human beings are SUPPOSED to eat. I mean grow up! You sound like my 7 year old. He at least will eat them anyway (even though he doesn't like them).

    I'm sure you just HATE me for saying all this...and I'm sorry I was very mean about it (but you've been pretty mean to everyone else...so I don't feel bad ). I just don't think you will get anything anyone is saying because you are too young and immature and apparently your family has messed you up major. You gotta let go of this obsession with the flat stomach (I can tell you won't though).

    As far as getting an apartment at age 16...Is that LEGAL? I thought you had to be 18 or something. In your case maybe it WOULD be best. Your family is obviously messing you up...I suppose you can't do worse on your own.

    Have a GREAT life.
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    Old 11-21-2003, 02:17 PM   #24
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    i do want to say one thing about liking vegetables (seeing as i'm vegetarian, that's all i eat)

    but really, do most of you know that your tastes change about every 7 years? that's why when you are growing up, you might hate something, but later in life, you might LOVE it. this happened to me with salsa, of all things. i could not eat salsa to save my life because it was too spicy. but my tastes have changed over the years and i am now able to handle a little mild salsa. So, I guess i'm just trying to say, that maybe you don't like veggies now, but down the road you should try them again because you might actually like them because your tastes have changed.

     
    Old 11-21-2003, 02:30 PM   #25
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    >>Try Splenda (sucralose) sweetner. You can bake with it and it doesn't change it's flavor.<<
    wow, you are capable of a non-******-off sentence!! thanks for the tip.

    >>I think we should just leave you alone to your self pitying, narcissistic desires to be a "stripper, playboybunny, sexkitten WHATEVER" which is obviously what your sole desire in life is to be.<<
    um, WRONG. i want to be a model, NOT a stick-thin supermodel, but a clothing model...as in, someone who is FULLY CLOTHED. i admire playmates, sure, but that doesn't mean i would like to have 90-yr-old men j*** off to my picture. i would not exploit myself like that.


    >>You'll get your wish, I'm sure, and when you're dying of some sexually transmitted disease at the age of 17 or 18 from one of the many "boyfriends" you just "gotta" have, maybe you'll actually listen to some of these honestly helpful people who are trying to give you a little well meant advice.<<
    i don't think you have been reading any of my recent posts. i do NOT want sex until i am MARRIED at the age of 25 or older. i NEVER said i "gotta have" a boyfriend, i said i WANT one who treats me right, but i am not obsessive as you think i am. and i HAVE been taking many people's advice about men. i can name at least 3 people who have changed my whole perspective on dating.

    >>You won't take any advice unless it's "easy" enough for you AND if it gets you your damn "FLAT STOMACH".<< if you actually read my last post you would realize i have taken a LOT of advice such as salad, vitamins, chiropractors, life beyond men...

    >>You are so single mindedly interested in ONLY ONE THING. HOW YOU LOOK. There is a whole world out there with men who don't give a rip about whether a girl has a "flat stomach" or not.<<
    i know this, but most of the reason i want a flat stomach is so that i can fit into tight shirts. not to impress men, but to feel sexy. which does NOT mean i am interested in sex, since that is what you seem to think...

    >>The ones who DO care about flat stomachs are PRECISELY THE ONES WHO WILLLLLLLL CHEAT ON YOU!!!!! AND YET THAT"S WHAT YOU WANT???<<
    if you have been paying attention to what i have said i realized that a long time ago and basically said guys who want me for being a 'gothic barbie doll' won't want me for me, and aren't worth it.

    >>It's about MATERIALISM and SEX and that is it FOR YOU.<<
    ????? um...people call me a prude, i am waiting until marriage so how in the hell can i be 'all about sex?'

    >>You are COMPLETELY SHALLOW (from what I hear).<<
    um, no...what is wrong with wanting to look my best in a particular style of shirt?! i am no more narcissistic that any other 15 y/o girl, and yes that IS my real age.

    >>And you don't like veggies? Try to grow up and EAT THEM ANYWAY.<<
    you said i am this mean? JFC you sound like my stepdad with the grow-up lecture. and to be honest i *just* ate a large salad no more than half an hour ago, taking everyone's advice on this topic.

    >>As far as getting an apartment at age 16...Is that LEGAL?<<

    yes, if you get emancipated, and my mother agreed to do so.

     
    Old 11-21-2003, 03:43 PM   #26
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    You're right...a lot of this thread did "tick me off".

    As far as being able to compose a non "ticked" off sentence, this is the one and only time I've ever posted anything "angry". And I've posted ALOT. You just rub me the wrong way. But then teenagers do that to everyone.

    I'm not mad at you (or anyone else)...I guess I'm just FRUSTRATED. You come off as a very...know it all (or something). (You write very well for a 15 year old btw).

    So many young people think too much about what they look like, and it makes me very sad. Maybe I'm just terrified that my daughter will grow up and think that how you look is all that matters in life (because of media, t.v. etc.). You are just so young to be jaded like this. I realize that your upbringing has maybe done a lot of this to you.

    I am very glad that you don't plan on having sex until you are married. I truly hope you stick to your guns in this matter. I know that a lot of your attitudes will change as you get older. You won't care as much as you do now about what your body looks like or fitting into "tight" skirts. It's fine to want to look good, it helps with self esteem. Just try not to obsess about it so much. It will make you miserable to be constantly comparing yourself. It has a lot to do with your young age that makes you so obsessed with looking a certain way, I guess. I should remember what it was like to be 15. I'm glad you are taking some of the advice to heart.

    As far as sounding like your step-dad, I wouldn't know about that. I do know that I am not abusive (mentally or physically) in "real" life. I would not normally speak to someone the way I did to you.

    I don't recall you saying anything except that you admired playboy bunnies and models (what kind of life do they lead? It's about being sex symbols and making money nowadays, am I wrong?) and I thought you were saying you wanted your life to be like that. Maybe I was wrong. I don't recall you saying before that you planned on "waiting" for marriage, or that you didn't need a boyfriend. I thought you said you really wanted to have a flat tummy to attract a b/f? I read all the posts, maybe I missed that part? And if you changed your mind, GREAT!

    Anyway, I apologize for sounding like your "step dad". Although, if all he does is say the things that I said...I don't really see anything wrong with that. Except that it was harsh. I don't believe in yelling at kids and lecturing constantly or hitting, but someone has to set rules and have structure and discipline. It should come from your mother though, not a step parent.

    And btw, maybe try to get a hold of your language...it really shows your age.

    Your last post has changed my mind about you (at least some). Maybe there is hope. Age and experience will probably change a lot of things for you. I do hope you can eventually be happy with yourself as you are. Nothing wrong with wanting to look good. I want to as well. I have like 60 lbs to lose! But I am still happy with my life and myself. I want to be better but I'm not unhappy either. It's a waste of time to be so miserable about something so trivial as looking sexy in a tight skirt.
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    Old 11-21-2003, 04:28 PM   #27
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    You know what, I've gone about this the completely wrong way. Because you write well and convincingly, my mind keeps telling me you're an adult (except for the swearing). When I hear an adult say the things you say, it would make me a little "ticked". I have to remember that you are 15 and don't think like an adult. I have been WAY too harsh toward you considering your age. I've been thinking a lot about what I said and figure the reason you rub me the wrong way is because I keep thinking you are older than you actually are. So, for a person your age, I suppose you are doing and feeling things that many your age are.

    I'll apologize now and leave you to your...whatever .
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    Old 11-21-2003, 06:52 PM   #28
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    >>As far as being able to compose a non "ticked" off sentence, this is the one and only time I've ever posted anything "angry".<<
    likewise. alot of people who have replied to this post think of me as very frustrated/mad all the time, selfish, immature, short-tempered, stubborn etc. but what not very many people realize is that i am actually a very mature person, with the exception of four "triggers." these are: diet/my body, family/my past, psychology/iatry, and dating/my exes. this topic has managed to hit on all four of these. this is why i come off as extremely rude and 'a ticking time-bomb.' like you said, it's nothing personal.

    >>Maybe I'm just terrified that my daughter will grow up and think that how you look is all that matters in life (because of media, t.v. etc.).<<

    i can understand fearing that...and i know this doesn't make it any better, but your actions have nothing to do with whether she will grow up like me. unless of course, you tell her she has a fat [body part], but you don't. it's one of those things you just have to let fate handle, and pray that guys will not make her feel worthless. sorry, i shouldn't really talk, as i don't have children, but i know that even though the first reason i felt self-conscious was b/c of how clothes fit, a large part was because of how i was treated by guys. it shouldn't matter, but to a growing girl it means the world.

    >>It's fine to want to look good, it helps with self esteem. Just try not to obsess about it so much. It will make you miserable to be constantly comparing yourself.<<
    a good point...right now i am trying to find things like videogames and other ways to keep myself busy w/o everything revolving around the way i look. i'm not as obsessive as i was a year ago, thank god.


    >>I don't recall you saying anything except that you admired playboy bunnies and models (what kind of life do they lead? It's about being sex symbols and making money nowadays, am I wrong?) and I thought you were saying you wanted your life to be like that. Maybe I was wrong. I don't recall you saying before that you planned on "waiting" for marriage, or that you didn't need a boyfriend. I thought you said you really wanted to have a flat tummy to attract a b/f? I read all the posts, maybe I missed that part? And if you changed your mind, GREAT!<<
    i would definitely not like being in the adult industry...but as for being a model, just something harmless like a hot topic or black rose clothing girl would be fun. they realize that girls come in all shapes, sizes and colors [including spotted ]. it's not a high-pressure, sex-obsessing career like victoria's secret or anywhere else where you have to be a twig.
    the thing about my stomach and guys...well, what i meant by that is, i want to get revenge on the guys who have said i'm fat/ugly/whatever. just wanna stop by their school, looking attractive to them, and break their hearts like they broke mine. sounds twisted, pointless, immature and cruel, but those boys have caused some serious damage in the past...i just want to spite them for that. "you said i was ugly...look at me now." and leave.

    >>And btw, maybe try to get a hold of your language...it really shows your age.<<
    i'll try to do so when i hold a conversation, but when i write lyrics or poetry that depicts pain and hatred...[polite metal? does that exist?] that's something i probably won't change.

    >>Nothing wrong with wanting to look good. I want to as well. I have like 60 lbs to lose! But I am still happy with my life and myself. I want to be better but I'm not unhappy either. It's a waste of time to be so miserable about something so trivial as looking sexy in a tight skirt.<<
    maybe i will be happier with my life when i find my soulmate, or make more friends, or finally find a religion. you're right, it is a waste of time to obsess hardcore over looks. i would still like to know that i am doing everything i can to look as good as i can, and that is why i created this topic.
    (and by the way, i said 'shirt' not 'skirt.' i would not be caught dead in anything THAT revealing unless i was offered at least $20, by a chick, to do so .)

     
    Old 11-22-2003, 10:26 AM   #29
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    O.k., You have enlightened me quite a bit. I'm glad you're not as "angst" ridden as I at first thought. I know it's hard to put down all your thoughts and feelings in these posts. (otherwise it'* take up PAGES I'm sure) I am relieved! I truly hope you find what makes you happy.

    BTW, it takes a lot of courage to reply so level headedly to a rather harsh post like mine was. You explained yourself very well...But I still think you should eat your veggies :*

    Also, when I was your age I probably would have wanted "revenge" also, for what those boys did to you. Just try not to let your world revolve around that. You may never get "revenge" and I wouldn't want that to make you unhappy. They are stupid teenage jerks and boys can just be plain cruel at that age. I've had a few experiences myself.

    Another BTW: when I was about your age I also had a "tummy". I felt a "little" self conscious about it but not too much. I was also about 15 lbs UNDERWEIGHT so it was a bit more pronounced. As I got older (about 19ish) it looked pretty flat. Some people's bodies are just made differently too. I never had the totally flat stomach that models have (even being underweight). Now I wish I could even be just 15 lbs overweight :* . Your perceptions will change a lot as you get older.
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    Old 11-24-2003, 07:22 AM   #30
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    Re: a flat stomach...my one wish since age 10

    hey F.O.N., i know you really want to be a model and i just realized one thing... even if you DID have a flat stomach, chances are you will STILL have a hard time getting into that industry. didn't you say that you are 5'3"?? be aware that models are expected to be on the taller side, so if you don't have the career in modeling like you want, please just remember that it may just be something like your height that you can't control.

    good luck!

     
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