Discussions that mention synthroid

Thyroid Disorders board


[quote]Originally posted by woodswoman:

TSH 4.66 (.34-5.60) new AACE range (0.3-3.0)
Free T4 1.2 (.9-1.7)
T4 6.9 (4.5-12.0)
THBR 1.1 (0.8-1.2)

My TSH last year was 2.9. Yet, my CNP says my labs are normal. Apparently she doesn't know about the new AACE guidelines! Even at 2.9 I was symptomatic! She started me on 5mcg of cytomel on 9/25, when i had my blood drawn, (to complement Wellbutrin.) She then wants me to go back around 10/25 to have my T3 checked and switch to Effexor. I have stopped taking the Wellbutrin on my own after starting the cytomel - it seemed to be an even switch as far as energy level goes. But - when I was taking the full dose of Wellbutrin - 300 mgs/day, I was nauseated, didn't want to eat, and lost 30 lbs in six months. ...

I am NOT going to start Effexor - I had the electrical zings while on other SSRI's (paxil, celexa, prozac and floxetine(yes different than prozac for me)

So, my questions are:

1. what is THBR, and how do all my results fit together? I do know that my TSH is high, even at the higher end of the old normal range, and over the top of the new range.

2. Does anyone have experience with Wellbutrin and thyroid meds, and quitting wellbutrin for thyroid meds?

3. I'm thinking I need a new health care provider. Recommendations in Twin Cities area?

4. I have previously discussed my complaints, (all the basic thyroid symptoms - worsening complexion, fatigue, mental anguish) with my CNP, we decided (as my thyroids labs were "normal") that it is a life-long seretonin/brain issue, thus the anti-D, BUT now I think it could be a life-long thyroid issue. Why is this so difficult to work with?

I am eagerly anticipating your educated replies!

WW

[This message has been edited by woodswoman (edited 10-07-2003).]


sorry we missed your post -- i replied to the other one ...

i'm not a doctor, BUT: every time i see that someone has all the syptoms of hypo and their doctor fails to "connect the dots" (happened to me!), i'm just enraged [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/blob_fire.gif[/img] ...

i'll address your concerns in the order in which i'm familiar with them, and boy am i familiar with ...

#4. with a TSH of 4.66, i don't know how you are still walking around, and i'd run screaming from your current clinic ...i had all those symptoms and then some (that you may not think to asssociate w/hypo) with a TSH of 3.9: horrible constipation, ALWAYs cold (bone-shakingly), exhaustion, gravely voice, shrieking pain in my legs, bloating (both legs, hands, and face) and yes, depression (your "mental anguish") from a lack of T3 ... now that i've been taking cytomel, my ADs can kick in ...

my first TSH test was 3.9 (march -- JUST AWFUL symptoms), the latest was 1.01 (september) and my endo bumped me up to 125mcg synthroid (i have to tell you that the first endo i went to [endo-from-hell] in mid-april said i needed a shrink for my depression, refused cytomel, so my GP gave me some, and the rise in my T3 level eventually allowed my AD to work) ... and it's not difficult to work with if you have someone who can "connect the dots" ... i'm constantly amazed that the TSH range is as much as it is and still be called "normal": 0.3 to 3.0? i'm still hypo at 1.01!! i still can't believe your TSH of 4.66 -- gotta be hypo by ANYONE'S standards!!! :eek:

possibly because your T4 and free T4 were sort of mid-range she didn't consider you hypo ... i dunno!!

#3 you need a new health care provider ASAP because you are being treated irresponsibly (i think) by your current one, but i don't know the area -- anyone else?

#2 i don't have any experience w/wellbutrin, but you don't have to quit the wellbutrin to take a thyroid med ... i'm taking an AD (manerix, not available in the states), 125mcg synthroid, and 5mcg cytomel twice a day ... why would you have to go off wellbutrin if you feel good (relatively!) on it? of course, if you don't ... oh, i just noticed that you were nauseated on it ( [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/confused.gif[/img] ) ... hmmm ... i don't blame you for not wanting to take the SSRIs if they don't agree w/you (didn't w/me -- made me so anxious i nearly crawled out of my skin) ... (so far, manerix works for me and has no side effects, but as i say -- not available in the US) ...

#1 meep/dea4 (and others) are much better qualified to answer the THBR question, since i've never heard of it, and addressed only it briefly in my first post ... perhaps you could post a topic about THBR?

i don't know why we missed your posts, but will try not to let it happen again ... as i said, i didn't know you'd made an earlier most comprehensive post, so excuse my ignorance in the first one, and remember the "bump" ("hey! you out there!") if it happens again ...

make my blood boil, the way hypos are treated :mad: ...

ah well, you've found friends in this board!!

:D jb

[This message has been edited by jinglebts (edited 10-12-2003).]

[This message has been edited by jinglebts (edited 10-12-2003).]
[quote]Originally posted by woodswoman:
I am going to keep this thread going, as it is more comprehensive with respect to replies.

...

I have had the antibody test – have had antibodies since 1999. I first had thyroiditis in 1997, when I first had a virus and noticed swelling and extreme fatigue. (Also one year post-partem after 2nd child) These symptoms have recurred every 6-12 months since. But numbers have always been in “range.” Arg. I will ask for the T3 test.

When you say that you don’t know how I am still walking around – I am, just barely! I am managing just enough to get by, can get clean clothes for the kids, make simple meals, get kids to school (usually nearly late) and that is all. I used to sew, read, I don’t even watch TV anymore. I don’t do anything, not interested in anything. My husband is frustrated – I can understand why. Sometimes I think I need to buck up – but I can’t. Really the main symptoms I have are fatigue and depression (although I wouldn’t call it clinical depression) I don’t have physical problems except for occasional arthritis in my hands (it isn’t really bad – although I did notice it this last time I had the recent swelling/fatigue episode – hadn’t noticed a correlation before). I also have more gray hairs than I think I should for someone 36 years old, but is not much. It is also really difficult to exercise. (Muscles just can’t do it.) And heart palpitations which I was always told "anxiety" and here is your rx for anti-depressant.


BUCK UP?? you can't -- you're ill! with a TSH of 4.66 - well, mine was 3.9 and i thought i'd die -- literally -- so tired i fell asleep at the drop of a hat (18 hours a day!!), heart palps, so depressed i nearly killed myself (truly), and in my case so much leg pain i used to weep when i first got out of bed ... in my case, i need some cytomel (T3) too, to provide a level at which an AD actually works (the first endo didn't agree -- said i needed a shrink and depression wasn't a symptom of hypo) ...

range be damned (at 3.9 i was w/in the 0.5 to 5.0 that was the current range) .. i had vicious symptoms, and an astute GP whom i'd consulted for CFS actually did the test, my present GP treated me 'til i got an appt with the endo-from-hell (still, he gave me synthroid), and then i got a new endo ...

i'm depressive, and i've come to accept that it "runs in families" -- my dad was an alcoholic (self medicated because there WERE no ADs in the 50's to the 70's), my mum was depressive (she just used to cry, until paxil came along), i think my paternal grandmother was, and i've been on various ADs since my early 40's (when i say "various", we went thru' a time last summer when NO AD worked -- remeron, effexor, luvox, paxil -- and finally i realised that my T3 might be the problem, even tho' it was "w/in range" so i tried some cytomel) ... frankly, it made me feel stunned but at least i didn't have this dreadful psychic pain ... finally, a drug called manerix (not available in the US) worked, but it's still tricky ...

i tell you my history because, with a bi-polar father and a grandmother who used to sit in a dark room and rock, you may have this disease, depression, too ... it's a real disease, a serotonin imbalance; you can't help it, and please don't shy away from the DX of depression; i sense that you ARE denying your depressive history (of course, there's absolutely NOTHING that says you have to have it -- it's just that those w/family members who have it too are more likely to have it themselves)...

being hypo and having depressive illness at the same time is not a fun combination ...

I get mad. I want to cry. I don’t know where to go to get treated. ... you poor sweetie, is there NO alternative to your present situation? can you not get another "doctor" (hah!)? can you go in and ask to TRY some synthroid? in a thriving metropolis like minneapolis, is there NO recourse? there must be...

the mayo is only a couple of hours away in rochester -- can you not get SOMEONE to refer you? do you need a referral? (i know it's expensive -- but it's awesome :round: !)

in response to your first post, point 4: depressive illness (which you may or may not have -- sorry, but i happen to think you do) has nothing, technically, to do with the thyroid -- it's a matter of serotonin (and other) levels and that's that, BUT anything that affects your serotonin (et al) levels plays a part in how you feel (in this case, your thyroid, which controls absolutely everything), and that's why a combo of cytomel/AD works for me;i needed the T3 (cytomel) first (shrinks use a cytomel/AD combo, and it's quite effective -- why not???)...

as for your husband, you have to tell him how you feel, perhaps show him these responses -- i'd rather have just about anything than this damned hypo; there are lots of people on this board who would agree w/me ... i'm being treated so of course i'm SOMEWHAT better, but i don't think i'll ever be my old self again, and i'm in awe of you for taking care of your kids and cooking -- i simply couldn't ...

i get the impression too that you don't want to have "clinical depression": well, depression is depression, whichever way you look at it, and either you treat it or you don't ( :eek: ), but really, i think there are only "diagnosed depression" and "undiagnosed depression", and that's it ...

look, you're ill; get the books "thyroid for dummies", "living well with hypothyroidism", anything by dr. arem ridah; there's a host of others (type "thyroid books" into google), and most importantly, get your husband to read one -- he doesn't understand the disease (i've lost "friends" over it) and he's entitled to know what's going on with your body and mind ...

i'm so sorry you feel like this, because i remembered a time when i didn't know where to turn and finally found this board ... there are two topics, one called "i'll tell you my story, you tell me yours" posted by Tree Frog and the other just called "information thread" - they're both HUGE, but you'll get some idea of what we've gone thru', and the Information thread is very informative ...

i'm rambling and it's very late, so nitey-nite, and talk to 'ya soon!!!

:D jb

ps: and don't even TRY to "buck up" ... you need meds and a positive attitude, but don't deny that you feel absolutely horrible :( ...


[This message has been edited by jinglebts (edited 10-13-2003).]
[QUOTE]Originally posted by girlygirly:
I do believe that depression can be caused by a thyroid disorder. It is documented as a symptom. Perhaps your poor relatives had undiagnosed thyropid disorders since they do run in families. And yes, men do get it also. Usually the way you can determine if it is your thyroid or not is by how the depression meds are working. If they don't work then it usually is thyroid related.


you're right, GG, NO depression med. worked until i got my thyroid straightened out ...

"we went thru' a time last summer when NO AD worked -- remeron, effexor, luvox, paxil -- and finally i realised that my T3 might be the problem, even tho' it was "w/in range" so i tried some cytomel)" ... don't misread me -- if your thyroid doesn't work, nothing works, and it may well be that what you need is a synthroid/cytomel combo alone and that will transform you ... it did me, to the extent that i was able to TAKE ADs again and they worked ... all i meant was with the bi-polar dad (who knows what was wrong w/the grandmother -- could have been thyroid disease -- except in the "olden" days, one just went to one's doctor and said, "look, i have all these symptoms," he prescribed something for you (armour?), and you were treated -- none of this STUPID relying on numbers ONLY) ...

some people swear by armour, but it has too much T3 for some people, so don't think you're weird if it doesn't work ...

certainly, your primary goal is to get your thyroid straightened out ... then if you're still depressed and don't want to go the AD route, cognitive behavioral therapy is something to look at -- with CBT, the serotonin level has been seen to rise in fMRIs (functional MRIs) ... but that's a long time from now, and i hope you're better with a synthroid/cytomel combo, or armour ...

baby steps!!

your certified nurse practitioner is a fool, and the thing that makes it disastrous is that she's dealing with human lives ...

and i've had those brain shocks too (i don't recall with which drug) and when i told the doctor, all he said was "oh,"; when i was on BC pills a number of years ago, i used to get these sudden pass-out slap-in-the-head things (had one in the car and fell over -- good thing i wasn't driving) and all my OB/GYN said was -- you got it -- "oh," and changed me to another BC pill ... how dumb was that!!

you first step -- get your thyroid under control, and go from there ...

:D jb

[This message has been edited by jinglebts (edited 10-13-2003).]